Tagged With "billing"

Blog Post

5 Reasons Billing by Seat Could Change Everything

Guest ·
As an Managed Print or Managed IT Services Dealer providing MPS you have noticed that the times are changing. There is an all-out war for the management of printers, pages and other network assets such as desktops and servers. Margins on traditional billing models are under pressure. What is a Managed Print or Managed IT Services provider to do? Change the game by billing by seat instead of by page or individual network element. Here are the top 5 advantages to PSB over traditional Cost Per...
Blog Post

Five Reasons Why Copier Dealers Need to Implement Their Own Flat Rate Program

Art Post ·
On Saturday I received an email from a Print4Pay Hotel member stating that one of his largest accounts is under siege with Konica Minolta's new unlimited click program. The KM unlimited click program is hot with the KM sales team because it gives them a different talk track with the client. The KM reps will be pitching unlimited clicks, simplified billing, no overages. The competition will have their old out dated legacy cost per page program. Can you guess who will win the majority of the...
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Re: 7 Deadly Topics from 7 Deadly Sinners at Top 100 Summit (Part One)

Czech ·
Is it just me, or does West McDonald look like Wolverine? I watched the Seat-Based Billing video that was posted from the Top 100 Summit. Definitely some interesting points going back and forth. Print Audit has done a great job of persistently marketing seat-based pilling to the copier industry.
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Re: 7 Deadly Topics from 7 Deadly Sinners at Top 100 Summit (Part One)

Art Post ·
Czech funny you should mention that "wolverine" look, it was actually one of the "challenges" at the event. Whom ever had the most completed challenges won a MS Surface tablet. I did not win.
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Re: 7 Deadly Topics from 7 Deadly Sinners at Top 100 Summit (Part One)

txeagle24 ·
I disagree that you have to own the network in order to offer seat-based billing. Before I go into why, can we (imaging industry) please stop referring to Managed Services as MNS? No one in the IT world uses this term; it's industry jargon that makes you stand out as a copier dealer 1st and an IT Services provider 2nd. Managed IT Services, Managed Services...fine. MNS needs to die. Now, here is why I disagree that you have to own the network as a client's Managed Services provider in order...
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Re: 7 Deadly Topics from 7 Deadly Sinners at Top 100 Summit (Part One)

Art Post ·
Tx, awesome post! The conclusion for managed IT was at our own round table and not the general audience. One of the dealers in my group is heavily involved with managed IT, and thought it would be great offer. Yes, it was stated that MNS is only used by copier dealers and should be referenced to what you described. TY for the awesome reply!!
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Re: 7 Deadly Topics from 7 Deadly Sinners at Top 100 Summit (Part One)

txeagle24 ·
I will also add since you mentioned wanting to do this on copiers/MFPs: our industry also needs to get the idea that MPS only has to do with printers & A4 MFPs out of their heads. Output is output, & our clients don't see any difference so why should we? Properly deploy what systems meet the client's needs (or just get rid of them if that is best) & be of service in whatever way you can. Hell, our customers want all of this stuff to go away (just wait til the Millenials are in...
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Re: 7 Deadly Topics from 7 Deadly Sinners at Top 100 Summit (Part One)

Art Post ·
Is it just me, it seems that the general rule of thumb for the copier industry to end users is "the take or leave approach". Meaning, come hell or high water we're not going to change the way we bill, the way we support, or the financial solutions that we offer. While I was at the Top 100 conference, a rep from Wells Fargo spoke about the billing options that they now have in their leases. One of the options was for seat billing for managed IT services. My thought is that if it's available...
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Re: 7 Deadly Topics from 7 Deadly Sinners at Top 100 Summit (Part One)

txeagle24 ·
No, Art. You're spot on. I haven't had many jobs outside the industry, but the majority of the old guard is so proud of the way they've always done it & receives so much validation from other dealers with the same mentality (via BTA, CDA, SDG, et al) that they often refuse to admit the need to change until it's practically too late. There are ideas & concepts that I brought up 3-5 years ago that were considered to be "interesting but not really necessary" that we're suddenly latching...
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Re: 7 Deadly Topics from 7 Deadly Sinners at Top 100 Summit (Part One)

Art Post ·
Great minds think alike!
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Re: 7 Deadly Topics from 7 Deadly Sinners at Top 100 Summit (Part One)

gwalters2009 ·
Originally Posted by txeagle24: I disagree that you have to own the network in order to offer seat-based billing. Before I go into why, can we (imaging industry) please stop referring to Managed Services as MNS? No one in the IT world uses this term; it's industry jargon that makes you stand out as a copier dealer 1st and an IT Services provider 2nd. Managed IT Services, Managed Services...fine. MNS needs to die. Now, here is why I disagree that you have to own the network as a client's...
Comment

Re: Who's Afraid of the Epson WorkForce C20590 100ppm MFP?

printguy ·
Hey Art have you been seeing this machine out in the field yet? How is it performing if you have. Epson just sent me info on adding their product line, I gotta say I'm intrigued, but don't really see any reviews of the product from anyone I know in the industry.
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Re: Who's Afraid of the Epson WorkForce C20590 100ppm MFP?

Art Post ·
I haven't seen one in the field yet. There are a few dealers on this site (pretty regular) that took that product on. @Jason H or eddy jones. they might be able to tell you more than I can. I do like the product though!
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Re: Who's Afraid of the Epson WorkForce C20590 100ppm MFP?

Jason H ·
@printguy @Art Post We have not sold a single one yet. Most people seem to have no interest in ink. I like the product. It is a Kyocera finisher. The problem with the finisher is that it slows the machine down to half speed. So ultimately someone is getting a 50ppm system, not a 100ppm if you have the finisher. Space is an issue if you have the finisher. I talk about the product to everyone but most people revert back to a toner system. I don't think this is going to be a game changer as...
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Re: Who's Afraid of the Epson WorkForce C20590 100ppm MFP?

printguy ·
Thanks for the info @Jason H . That's unfortunate, however I get the aversion to ink. Looking at this product it appeared Epson had perfected it. However I don't think I could sell a copier that has a huge paper curl. I never thought it would have a page curl as there is no fuser.
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Re: Who's Afraid of the Epson WorkForce C20590 100ppm MFP?

Jason H ·
I think the part of the problem is even though the ink is dry, it has a moist feeling to it. When it drops off into the trays there is a hump (see pic) that the paper drops out on. I think that is part of the problem with the curl. The prints look good and once I lay the paper out on a desk it flattens out but in my opinion it just does not demo well with regular paper.
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Re: Who's Afraid of the Epson WorkForce C20590 100ppm MFP?

Art Post ·
interesting, I know wonder if Epson demonstrated the device with heavier paper at a few of the events I was at. I didn't see any curl. Not saying that it doesn't, but it wouldn't be the first time peeps did a "controlled" demo
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Re: Who's Afraid of the Epson WorkForce C20590 100ppm MFP?

Jason H ·
Ill try to do a video once the machine gets back to my office. It is on a truck back from one of our branch offices now. I just don't think it demo's well in front of the customer.
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Re: Who's Afraid of the Epson WorkForce C20590 100ppm MFP?

Martin Hofman ·
Have you noticed the Kyocera 'link'? Take a look at the LCT on the right side of this Epson C20590...... it's the Kyocera PF-770 in Epson color.
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Re: Who's Afraid of the Epson WorkForce C20590 100ppm MFP?

Art Post ·
Marin, you are correct. Was also told that the finisher is also Kyo, but they would not be staying with that finisher. Connect with me via email or PM, there may be some opps for you with Epson
Blog Post

The Death of the Cost Per Page Billing Model

Art Post ·
Guess what's coming to your business neighborhood? Did ya give up yet? Yes, the cost per click aka the cost page could become the billing model of the past. Seat Based Billing with Print Audit About a year ago Print Audit released a Seat Based Billing model for MPS engagements, The gist of the billing model is to bill a monthly flat fee per employee in order for the user to have printing rights. The amount billed per employee covers support, parts, software and consumable items for those...
Blog Post

Who's Afraid of the Epson WorkForce C20590 100ppm MFP?

Art Post ·
It's just about 9:30PM, I arrived home from the Epson Road Show (special shout out to Impression Solutions Inc., and Joe Buck for the invite) in Philly about four hours ago. My plans were to skip writing tonight and watch the Mets game, well that plan failed since the Mets are in a rain delay. As I listened to Bob Palmer (Research Director with IDC's Imaging) during the opening session for the Epson Road Show today, I found my-self in agreement that disruption for the copier industry will...
Blog Post

7 Deadly Topics from 7 Deadly Sinners at Top 100 Summit (Part One)

Art Post ·
What's one of things I found out about on my recent trip to the Top 100 Summit (hosted by Print Audit)?  I'm a stone cold junky for sea level oxygen!  Having lived at or around sea level all of my life, meant that I had no clue that my body...
Blog Post

Does anyone have a clue as to how the CPC billing model started in the first place?

Art Post ·
Cost Per Image, Cost Per Page, Cost Per Copy, Cost Per Print, whatever you call it, it all started with the copier industry. The question above was posed by Greg Walters with a recent thread that was posted on LinkedIn.  I stated the reply...
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Re: The Death of the Cost Per Page Billing Model

Martin Hofman ·
Hi Art, Here’s my prediction for the future: A3 MFP’s will be bought on the internet without any interference from sales-reps, print-specialists, installation-technicians, etc. etc. I think the Copier Industry isn’t any different from Audio/Video, Household-appliances, Insurances, Phones, Vacations, Cars, and all other business of which we thought we would always need a technical- or sales specialist? They will be delivered (and installed!) by DHL, FEDEX, UPS, and if broken, fixed by...
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Re: The Death of the Cost Per Page Billing Model

Czech ·
Don't forget that Epson just released their new A3 inkjet MFP. Very interested to see how that pans out as well! I can't tell you how many times I've lost a deal because a dealer "disguises" their a base amount of copies inside the lease payment. Customers are willing to pay more to not have to worry about monthly print usage and have a predictable monthly payment. This seems crazy at first, but then I thought about it and it's everywhere... We pay a flat rate cell phone bill instead of "per...
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Re: The Death of the Cost Per Page Billing Model

Art Post ·
Martin I hope I'm retired by the time your prediction comes true!
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Re: The Death of the Cost Per Page Billing Model

BCarroll ·
Hi Art The Pagewide service model is the one we use for our Canon ImagePROGRAF plotters. Based upon customer's needs, we quote an annual contract for service. This contract, like the original 1- year warranty from Canon, excludes user- replaceable items (ink, paper, printhead(s), and maintanence cartridge). If the system includes a scanner, we account for that in the quoted price. So essentially, we will repair / replace any item not user-replaceable. Canon offers the same "service" contract...
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Re: The Death of the Cost Per Page Billing Model

Art Post ·
Thanx for this. Thus the maintenance agreement for the ImagePrograf and provides a flat fee with unlimited prints, right? The user would then also pay for any consumables, do I have this right?
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Re: Does anyone have a clue as to how the CPC billing model started in the first place?

Wallingford ·
What came next with some dealers in the Oz market, was a guarantee that the client's copy costs would not rise annually, above a maximum of 10% which most clients would agree to. Or that it would only rise by the CPI, which these days is a joke of a deal, as it is only around 2%. But some now guarantee to hold the pricing for the term of the rental agreement, which at 5 years is just down right stupid.This has now become a lot more prevalent, as weak salesmen sell (if you can call it...
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Re: Does anyone have a clue as to how the CPC billing model started in the first place?

Art Post ·
Wallingford Thanx for this! From your thread I can tell we all have most of the same issues. Anyone else care to help with their first experience with CPC?
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Re: Does anyone have a clue as to how the CPC billing model started in the first place?

txeagle24 ·
I've only been around 9 years, but when I first started, we were selling the old Ricoh AP3800CMF (A3 color printer w/ a scanner kit attached to make it an MFP) since the 1224c/1232c was such a bust. In our Service Agreements, black toner was included in the CPP, but color toner was billable. When trying to get those customers to upgrade to the 2238c, I would create a cost per page analysis (since toner was included in our CPP for the 2238c) and had several furious customers who thought we...
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Re: Does anyone have a clue as to how the CPC billing model started in the first place?

John Saramak ·
I remember it well and at ComDoc, in the early 80's we sometimes put the offer out there without it being a formal price plan. I think the customer realized that a lot of the toner they purchased and stocked was useless at end of the machines life. It was like a primer with a customer who had that and TCO on their mind, it was a way to close them. Equally, I remember taking it one step further in the early 90's with copy management - the first all inclusive (hardware, service, supplies)...
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Re: Does anyone have a clue as to how the CPC billing model started in the first place?

Old Glory ·
I remember a plan that didn't really take hold but it was a plan like the one John talked about and all accessories were proposed in the form of copies...you want a finisher, just commit to 10,000 additional copies per month. The CPC rate had an equipment portion attached to it so more clicks funded more equipment. If the CPC was normal plus .003, 10,000 clicks added $30/month which would fund $1,500 additional. Some customers that weren't willing to pay $1,500 would agree to 10,000 more...
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Re: Does anyone have a clue as to how the CPC billing model started in the first place?

Art Post ·
Wow! These are some awesome stories, I'm sure there are many more out there from some of our veterans, would love to read more.
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Re: Five Reasons Why Copier Dealers Need to Implement Their Own Flat Rate Program

Larry Kirsch ·
Have been employing one rate for many years. Very helpful.
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