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Had an email from a P4P'er today that goes into detail about the product launch of the Epson plotters and the MFP scanning kit.  So, let me say, "laughable"!!  Epson is dictating the Epson UMRP (Unilateral Minimum Resale Price).

 

All I can say is the pricing I saw on the launch package for the Epson UMRP is way out of whack and I've seem many of these devices on the internet for far less than the EPSON UMRP.

 

I ask you, when the %$#$ is Ricoh going to get their act together with wide format?

 

Your thoughts?

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They are never going to get their act together. I spoke with Jim Corridi at the CDA meeting several months ago and he told me big things were coming down the pipeline very soon because he agreed it would be hard to upgrade 3406WD systems with a 3406WD  system. He also, however, acted like the Epson was going to be the latest and greatest thing for all of us that sell wide format. Not sure why since we don't typically mess with the ink jet machines. You can find the Epson's extremely cheap online from any sources.

We were talking with KIP but my father did not want to order 2 or 3 machines at one time for inventory like they wanted us to. I talked with Oce' and the guy was pretty much like talking to a wall and said he didn't need anymore dealers in his territory and pretty much hung up. I would like to have an alternative and not be at Ricoh's mercy. I have tried to upgrade 3406's with 3406's and it doesn't go over that well.

Jason,

Talk to KIP again I have never heard of KIP asking dealers to stock machines(maybe one for the demo floor).

Plus KIP is releasing the new 800 series next month and these machines look like they should be good sellers. 8 full color "D"s per minute and 10K less that the Oce colorwave.

We sell or have sold all the major lines of wide format, KIP, Oce, Ricoh, even going back to Xerox. All our sales reps and techs prefer the KIPs.

 

GR

The Epson thing is a joke.  You can buy it on-line for less than you can buy it from Ricoh and so can your customer.

 

I've got a customer right now who is at end of term on a 48 month lease on a LW426 and I have no choice but to go back to them with the exact same machine......oh and my cost is now higher for that same machine thanks to Plotworks (which gets thrown in the garbage).

 

Would love to have KIP now.

Last edited by fisher
Only 16% of W3601 users turned on Plotworks!!! (from PLP)
 
Originally Posted by fisher:

The Epson thing is a joke.  You can buy it on-line for less than you can buy it from Ricoh and so can your customer.

 

I've got a customer right now who is at end of term on a 48 month lease on a LW426 and I have no choice but to go back to them with the exact same machine......oh and my cost is now higher for that same machine thanks to Plotworks (which gets thrown in the garbage).

 

Would love to have KIP now.

 

I do find the Ricoh's to be very reliable. What they need is speed though, IMO. Have worked with a steel maker on some projects and he has 4 big Oce's that run all day long, 5 days a week. He loved the 3406 but said he would have to buy about 8 or 10 of them do the same work the 4 high speed Oce's run. He wouldn't bite on the 7140's either.

Wide Format is in a big transition right now, I know KIP is no longer going to be putting any R&D into monochrome printing anymore. Its all color from this point forward, I know Oce (or CSA) is thinking the same way. I can't speak for Ricoh but at this point why would you put any money into it. Ink jet is not the answer ether so the Epson deal in not going to get you into too many doors. If the KIP 800 series is priced right (somewhere in the $25K-30K area) a lot of them will be going in. The big reason for the color switch is that the AEC industry now has the BIM (Building information modeling) requirments.

Originally Posted by Art Post:
Only 16% of W3601 users turned on Plotworks!!! (from PLP)
 
Originally Posted by fisher:

The Epson thing is a joke.  You can buy it on-line for less than you can buy it from Ricoh and so can your customer.

 

I've got a customer right now who is at end of term on a 48 month lease on a LW426 and I have no choice but to go back to them with the exact same machine......oh and my cost is now higher for that same machine thanks to Plotworks (which gets thrown in the garbage).

 

Would love to have KIP now.

 

I would be absolutely shocked if 16% really set up PlotWorks.  I can tell you its been 0% here.  I'm guessing that 15% out of the 16% that did set it up were Ricoh direct sales.

The Epson argument has been going on for years. I brought one product in as a complement product and direct print production sales fought for Epson devices as part of the portfolio. I wouldn't allow it.

However, with Vellek in charge of all product marketing, a lot changed. Overall profitability on Epson to Ricoh is about 7-9%. Plus there is no way to lock a customer into a toner inclusive deal when they could by it anywhere on the web. Losing proposition for Ricoh, winning for Epson.  I ran into the PMs at the PhotoPlus show and the couldn't be happier  

Also, with no R&D into color toner devices Ricoh is just floundering in wide format. 

We don't sell the Epson, I do hear that many Ricoh wide format dealers are looking to change.  The W3602 is due out something this spring, Ricoh is waiting to exhaust inventories on the W3601.  I have not sold a W3601 yet this year and believe I only sold a handful last year, I used to sell at least a dozen a year.

The W3602 will have the GUI as the color systems and many of the same features, sad but the GUI and the MFP features will still put us way behind with the likes of KIP & Oce

We are getting $.03 per sq ft. That is less than the monochrome machines, this is why I don't see us placing anymore new monochrome machines. We will place some refurbished ones to the customers that have to go low budget. Not only that it blows the Oce Colorwave away. We have a customer who makes these 20 ft full color GIS aerials that cost him $21.00 each to run on the Oce (his numbers not ours) we ran them on the KIP at a cost of $1.76. 

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