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I was told that it is basically the CL5000 as a copier. The color rep who showed us the CL5000 said that the copier uses a different toner cartridge, but it is on the same order. All cartridges are arranged vertically on the left side, one drum, paper path up the right side like the 1022. I will be at a launch for the color copiers on 2/25.
From: Ted Kochman (tedkochman@msn.com)
Date: Tuesday, March 04, 2003 05:03 PM

According to Ricoh's RMAP Full Maintenance, under Combo w/Ricoh Supplies: cpc is either 0.0145 or 0.0135. The note below states: "Combo includes Black Toner only; Color Toner not included". I gather that you can bill them as low as 0.0135 for everything excluding the color toner, which you would sell them. Or you could be creative and run the maintenance yourself, bill them a cpc for color clicks and include the toner.
We are trying to decide how to price our maintenance also. There are many interesting aspects to this copier and it's printer cousin, the CL5000. If I understand everything correctly, the idea of billing a CPP for black and billing for color toner separately isn't a great idea as many of the "parts" (DV units, PC's) are "development" dependant, not copy (print) dependant.

Using the Ricoh Service Cost Fact Sheet, it appears that the CPP for B&W with toner with a 30% margin would be about $.01. The retail CPP for color without toner would be about $.025.

At 30% of total pages being color(max suggested) then a CPP of $.0145 for all pages would be just about right (Make 10 prints, 7 B&W = $.07 (7x $.01), 3 color = $.075 (3x $.025) for a total retail for the 10 prints of $.145 = 10 x $.0145 (Ricoh suggestion) per page (regardless of type of print).

The problem is how to limit the color to a max of 30% of the volume because at %40 color the retail "cost" per page goes to $.016 (while still only getting $.0145). Perhaps a high enough retail price on the color toner would be enough to control useage.

Another problem is that the CPC for CL5000 is higher even though mechanically we're talking about the same engine. One could be in trouble if you sold one of each to the same customer and tried to explain away the difference.

Sorry to ramble (and actually writing this has helped clear up things for me!) but I'm looking for some opinions as are others.

Last of all is anyone doing CPP for the 3800C's? This one get's way more complicated as so many consumables are "rotations" dependant rather than page or development dependant. Any suggestions?

Cheers!
We charge the way RMAP does...$0.0135/click includes everything but color toner.
Ricoh's Service Cost Fact Sheet has black copies @$0.0081/copy (assuming 6% coverage).
Color copies generate $0.054/copy ($.0135 x 4 clicks) plus retail on whatever colored toner they use. Cost is less than $0.021/copy excluding supplies. Add Black toner costs of app. $0.003/copy and you get a cost of less than $0.025/copy giving a markup of 100% even if they don't buy their colored toner from you. Retail sales price on colored toner makes it even sweeter.

We decided we're comfortable with that.

It is critical here that you don't waste the small window of opportunity to exclusive rights on a revolutionary product bickering over how to price the service. Tell the powers that be at your company that they have to do something even if its wrong so that you can make hay while the sun is shining.
I preface my remarks by saying that I'm involved on the service side of the business which obviously leads to a certain bias, but to say "Tell the powers that be at your company that they have to do something even if its wrong so that you can make hay while the sun is shining." reflects an obvious bias as well. While recognizing that placing equipment is essential for the success of any company (and that this excellant site is sales oriented), to do so without regard for the profitablility of the aftermarket is shortsighted at best. (this sounds much more vindictive than I intended it to be...sorry!)

Since I'm at home and don't have the RMAP information available, I would agree that if the RMAP pricing reflects charging by developments rather than copies/pages then it is adequate. I was under the impression that it was based on copies/pages.

Anyone have any plans or thoughts concerning the 3800C in terms of CPP pricing?

Again, sorry about the rant at the begining but it is a sensative issue with me. (relax, Tom....breathe...)

Cheers
Tom:

We do not offer a cpp for the 3800. The main reason is that developments, page yields and the system running four developments to make a black print after a color is crazy.

Our DSM ws in today and suggested that we charge 13 to 20 cpp on the 1224, 1234 for color prints and copies. I thought lets not get out if hand here.

I also heard him say that Katun is readying after market toner for the 3800 and 1224, 1234 systems. So, it seems that a total cpp may be the way to go to keep our companies profotable. I beleive that .12 cent cpp is fair for the 1224, we will see.

Art

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